111: Leadership Evolved with Ken Jacobs

In this episode, Dan welcomes back legendary communicator, connector, and executive coach to the PR industry, Ken Jacobs, for his second appearance on the show. Back in January 2021, he and Dan talked about leadership and purpose in the agency world. Now, with the pandemic in the rearview, has widespread indecision and inconsistency around remote work, hybrid work, and RTO (Return to Office) changed the nature of leadership and management?

Ken and Dan dig into some of the changes we’ve seen over the past few years and try to find some answers. Ken walks us through the nuances of building a team in a remote setting and why managers still must be able to build and manage teams effectively. Remote working doesn’t seem like it’s going away anytime soon, even as some organizations push for a return to more traditional work settings. No matter what organizations are doing, though, the past few years have highlighted the importance of connection and connectedness for effective leadership - and we need a new playbook.

In this episode, you will be able to:

Uncover the ever-progressing dynamics of leadership within the context of the PR industry in a fluctuating global environment.
Navigate the ins and outs of remote work and running teams virtually in a post-pandemic world.
Find the balance between granting autonomy, instilling trust, and avoiding micromanagement in a team-centric setting.
Gain insight into the pivotal role of AI and other groundbreaking technologies in reshaping the PR industry.
Appreciate why adopting a learning attitude and making learning a lifetime habit stands as a key cornerstone of successful leadership.

Notable Quotes:

“I think this whole notion of connecting more and wanting to connect more and wanting more time together is partly due to the lockdown and also, they want to spend time with people who are natural connectors.” – (3:17), Ken
“Coaching isn’t what we do; it’s who we are.” – (5:46), Ken
“Make your office a magnet, not a mandate.” – (16:00), Ken
“It (remote working for PR) can be done. Can it be done better working together? Probably” – (18:58), Ken
“Is the team really a team if they’re not together?” – (22:24), Dan
“Every time you say it’s hard for me or I’m not good at, add the word … now.” – (30:30), Ken
“You don’t have to be a neuroscientist to use the neuroscience.” – (31:40), Ken
“When we say I wonder how that would feel, we actually start to feel it.” – (34:21), Ken
“We don’t realize it but many people who work for us, our followers, have a vision.” – (36:20), Ken
“It feels like the need for certain leadership attributes are on steroids.” – (41:05), Ken
“You’ve got to act in a trustworthy manner no matter the consequences.” – (42:23), Ken
“When you look at your past be very mindful to not judge yourself too harshly.” – (46:40), Ken
“It’s really important that you’re nurturing and not micromanaging.” (51:31), Ken
“One thing AI cannot do is mimic or replace emotional intelligence and empathy and trust.” – (1:01:13), Dan
“This notion of lifetime learning is absolutely critical.” – (1:04:55), Ken

About Ken Jacobs

Ken Jacobs is the principal of Jacobs Consulting & Executive Coaching, leveraging his expertise for over a decade to bolster agency growth, client relations, and staff performance. A recognized coach and consultant, Ken holds PCC credentials from the International Coach Federation and additional accreditations from iPEC, including CPC, ELI Master Practitioner, and CLDS. His rich experience encompasses collaborations with top-tier communications agencies such as Catalyst, Coyne Public Relations, and M Booth, to name a few. Before founding his firm, Jacobs dedicated 25 years to leadership roles in renowned PR agencies, notably spearheading the award-winning "MMC Masters" training program at Marina Maher Communications. Beyond his consulting, Ken shares insights in his "Taking The Lead" column for PRSA's Strategies and Tactics. An alumnus of Syracuse University's S.I. Newhouse School, he's also an honored member of PRSA, and a Senior Counselor to Prosper Group.

Ken Jacobs Links

Dan Nestle Links

The key moments in this episode are:

00:00:00 - Introduction,

00:01:48 - Connecting with Natural Connectors,

00:06:07 - Coaching During the Pandemic,

00:10:12 - Accelerated Change and Returning to the Office,

00:13:32 - In-Person Energy and Coordination,

00:15:56 - The Importance of Making the Office a Magnet, not a Mandate,

00:16:42 - Challenges of Remote Work and Real Estate,

00:18:30 - The Value of In-Person Collaboration,

00:19:51 - Leadership in a Remote Work Environment,

00:25:34 - Expectations Gap and Hiring Talent,

00:33:02 - The Relief of a Fresh Perspective,

00:34:16 - Customizing Leadership Styles,

00:36:11 - Building Trust and Connection,

00:42:58 - The Challenges of Virtual Leadership,

00:50:40 - The Importance of Nurturing Relationships in a Remote Work Environment,

00:53:19 - Setting Clear Expectations and Deadlines,

00:56:25 - Embracing AI and the Importance of Integration,

01:00:50 - Approaching AI with a Growth Mindset,

01:04:51 - The Importance of Lifetime Learning and Staying Relevant,

01:07:29 - Learning About AI,

01:08:12 - The Future of AI,

01:08:59 - Pivotal Person in Life,

01:10:49 - LinkedIn as the Platform of Choice,

01:14:35 - LinkedIn Fails and Harassment

Timestamped summary of this episode, courtesy of Capsho:

00:00:00 - Introduction,

Dan Nestle introduces the podcast episode and welcomes back Ken Jacobs, a former PR agency executive and leadership expert. They discuss the importance of pivotal moments and the role of people in those moments.

00:01:48 - Connecting with Natural Connectors,

Ken Jacobs talks about the desire to connect more with people who are natural connectors and how it transcends age. He emphasizes the importance of helping one another and how the lockdown during the pandemic accelerated the need for connection.

00:06:07 - Coaching During the Pandemic,

Ken Jacobs shares his experience as a coach during the pandemic and how he continued coaching even when clients couldn't pay. He highlights the importance of purpose-driven work and how emotional intelligence and empathy helped people thrive during challenging times.

00:10:12 - Accelerated Change and Returning to the Office,

The conversation shifts to the accelerated change brought on by the pandemic and the impact on work culture. They discuss the mixed approach of remote and in-office work and the need to reevaluate the purpose of going to the office. Ken emphasizes the importance of using in-person time effectively.

00:13:32 - In-Person Energy and Coordination,

Ken and Dan discuss the energy that comes from in-person interactions and the need to find a balance between remote and in-office work. They highlight the importance of coordinating in-person time to brainstorm and collaborate effectively.

00:15:56 - The Importance of Making the Office a Magnet, not a Mandate,

Ken Jacobs emphasizes the need for companies to give employees a reason to come back to the office beyond just basic perks like Taco Tuesday. Making the office a place for collaboration and idea generation is crucial, but it must be done in a way that respects individual preferences and safety concerns.

00:16:42 - Challenges of Remote Work and Real Estate,

Many companies had to downsize their office spaces during the pandemic due to financial constraints. However, finding the right balance of remote work and in-person collaboration remains a challenge. Different industries and organizations have unique needs and must determine what approach works best for them.

00:18:30 - The Value of In-Person Collaboration,

In agencies, where brainstorming and collaboration are vital, being physically present can enhance creativity and energy. While virtual collaboration is possible, the magic often happens when diverse teams come together in person. However, organizations must be mindful of including remote team members to ensure everyone feels connected.

00:19:51 - Leadership in a Remote Work Environment,

Great leaders must be empathetic, good listeners, and understand that it is impossible to please everyone. Balancing the needs and preferences of team members who want to work remotely or in the office requires careful consideration. Dialing up empathy and seeking feedback from employees are essential for effective leadership.

00:25:34 - Expectations Gap and Hiring Talent,

The expectations gap between agencies and employees spread across different locations has grown

00:33:02 - The Relief of a Fresh Perspective,

The conversation explores the feeling of relief and a breath of fresh air that comes with challenging preconceived notions and adopting a learner's mindset in leadership. It emphasizes the importance of self-growth and highlights the motivation that comes from imagining how achieving new perspectives and growth would feel.

00:34:16 - Customizing Leadership Styles,

The discussion delves into the significance of customizing leadership styles for each team member. It emphasizes the importance of understanding their values, vision, and learning styles to create alignment and motivation within the team. Taking the time to think about individual team members before interactions can greatly impact their engagement and fulfillment.

00:36:11 - Building Trust and Connection,

The conversation emphasizes the need for leaders to build trust and connection with their team members. This involves understanding their values, vision, and role in achieving the group's goals. By creating alignment between the organization's values, the leader's values, and the individual team members' values, leaders can foster a sense of belonging and fulfillment in their team.

00:42:58 - The Challenges of Virtual Leadership,

The discussion explores the challenges of building relationships and trust in a virtual work environment. It highlights the need for leaders to demonstrate courage, bravery, and trustworthiness, as well as to act as a source of stability and certainty during uncertain times. The importance of leading with empathy, emotional intelligence, and trust is emphasized, particularly in an unpredictable world.

00:50:40 - The Importance of Nurturing Relationships in a Remote Work Environment,

In a remote work environment, leaders need to be proactive in nurturing relationships to prevent complacency and maintain strong bonds within the team. Building trust and rapport is crucial, and leaders should focus on nurturing rather than micromanaging their employees.

00:53:19 - Setting Clear Expectations and Deadlines,

Leaders should have open and honest conversations with their team members about assignments, deadlines, and expectations. It is important to establish a contract where both parties agree on what success looks like and communicate any challenges or struggles early on.

00:56:25 - Embracing AI and the Importance of Integration,

AI is becoming increasingly important in the PR industry, and leaders should embrace it as a tool to enhance their work rather than fear it. Integration is also crucial, as PR professionals should explore how different channels and platforms can work together to maximize impact.

01:00:50 - Approaching AI with a Growth Mindset,

Instead of approaching AI with fear, leaders should have a growth mindset and view it as an opportunity to learn and improve their practice. AI can automate certain tasks, allowing professionals to focus on higher-value work and think of new ways to contribute.

01:04:51 - The Importance of Lifetime Learning and Staying Relevant,

Staying relevant in any field requires a commitment to lifetime learning. Professionals should continuously seek to expand their knowledge and skills to adapt to changing technologies and industry trends. Relevance is key to

01:07:29 - Learning About AI,

The guest expresses fascination with AI and how it can lead to deep exploration and questioning of what is true. They also express nervousness about being asked about their use of AI in their coaching practice in the future.

01:08:12 - The Future of AI,

The guest speculates about the possibility of speaking with an AI-generated simulacrum of the host in the future. They express their love for having conversations like these and the importance of maintaining a learner's mindset.

01:08:59 - Pivotal Person in Life,

The host expresses gratitude for the guest being a pivotal person in their life and discusses the importance of maintaining a learner's mindset as they move forward. They provide information on how to find the guest on LinkedIn and their website.

01:10:49 - LinkedIn as the Platform of Choice,

The guest discusses their decreased activity on Twitter and their preference for LinkedIn as a platform for professionals to connect. They also mention the annoyance of receiving LinkedIn messages from non-certified coaches.

01:14:35 - LinkedIn Fails and Harassment,

The host and guest discuss the humor in sharing LinkedIn fails and their experiences with fake profiles and spam messages. They acknowledge the entertainment value but also express frustration with the harassment.

*Notes were created by humans, with help from Capsho, my preferred AI show notes assistant.

111: Leadership Evolved with Ken Jacobs

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